Walk Through Podcast
The Walk Through Podcast shares authentic stories of navigating life’s valleys & victories, highlighting how we find God in the midst of every season of life. Co-hosted by Gianina and Kiley, each episode offers hope and inspirations through real, raw & faith-filled conversations.
Walk Through Podcast
Pastors Unplugged: When Your Leaders Admit They're Human with Sam & Alex
What happens when the people you look to for spiritual guidance admit they're struggling too? In this raw and refreshingly honest conversation, pastors Sam and Alex peel back the curtain on their personal journeys through addiction, anxiety, church hurt, and the everyday challenges of marriage and parenthood.
Alex shares how he expertly played the role of "good Christian kid" while secretly battling addiction until a DUI at age 16 became his breaking point. Sam reveals how she transformed from living a party lifestyle steeped in shame to finding her purpose in God—and how becoming a mother unexpectedly triggered anxiety she'd never experienced before. Their stories intertwine as they candidly discuss being fired from their youth pastor positions and the long, messy path to healing from bitterness.
You'll hear Sam's powerful testimony of wearing a heart monitor at a women's conference when the worship leader suddenly prayed specifically for her needs—a divine reminder that God sees our struggles in exquisite detail. The couple offers practical wisdom for marriages navigating "valley and victory" seasons, maintaining connection while raising children, and finding freedom from people-pleasing and fear.
Their vulnerability creates a sacred space where listeners can breathe easier knowing that spiritual growth isn't about perfection but persistent trust. Whether you're battling anxiety, healing from church hurt, or simply trying to balance faith with real life, Sam and Alex's story reminds us that God isn't just present in our victories—He's especially active in our valleys, writing in the sand beside us even when we feel most alone.
Welcome back to Walk Through the podcast, where we dive deep into life's valleys and victories and discover the presence of God in the middle of it all. In this episode, we sit down with Sam and Alex, two leaders who open up with refreshing honesty about the real struggles they faced, from fear and anxiety to people-pleasing, addiction and identity in the wrong places. You'll hear how God brought them through seasons of both brokenness and breakthrough and how they're learning to trust him in every area, whether they're walking through fear or standing in the middle of victory. Sam reminds us that prayer truly works and Alex shares how small disciplines and hard conversations can lead to lasting transformation. Together, they show us what it looks like to walk with God, not just when life is good, but especially when it's hard. This one is raw, real and full of hope. Let's dive in All right, guys.
Gianina:Well, I am so excited to have both of you on and it is definitely such a privilege to have both of my pastors, Pastor Sam and Alex, to be on this episode tonight, and I just I spent the my pastors, Pastor Sam and Alex, to be on this episode tonight and I just I spent the weekend last weekend with Sam and it was just really cool to have an opportunity to get to know her more. And, of course, I hear from Alex every Sunday, so I know that this episode is going to be really great and have so much just amazing gems that people are going to be able to pick out of them. So welcome you guys. Welcome, Thank you for having us.
Kiley:Yeah, it's an honor. I would like to say an official welcome to our first male voice, ooh hey let's go First male and first married couple. Yes, let's go. Lots of firsts tonight.
Alex:I know I'm honored to be in a predominantly female space. That's go Lots of firsts tonight. I know Honored to be in a predominantly female space.
Gianina:Fine with me, I know Usually it's the opposite. The females are in the predominantly male space, so this is like we're switching it up on you guys.
Alex:That's cool, I can hang.
Gianina:Yeah, for sure. Well, I would love if you guys wouldn't mind just sharing a little bit about your story and how you came to know the Lord, and just a little bit of background for our guests, so that they can get to know you guys better too. Sure.
Alex:Is it cool if I go first?
Alex:Yeah absolutely Okay. My upbringing was in a super duper Christian household. In fact it was in two Christian households, while my mom and dad were divorced. They got divorced at an early age. They got remarried just a few years later and really all my parents were seeking God, and not just like on their own but like literally all together. I grew up going to a church where my mom, stepdad, dad and stepmom went to the same church, were in the same Sunday school class and even sat on the same pews on Sunday mornings with me dividing them, which that's a whole story in and of itself. But that to say, I grew up in a super Christian home and upbringing but I never really was following Jesus. I mean, I went to church and knew the words to songs and was a part of youth groups and stuff, but I had not made that decision to follow Jesus until I was about 16.
Alex:Before that I was really good at just kind of being a Christian, playing the Christian role at church and then at home with my friends or at school. I was a very, very different person that my parents didn't really even know. I was so obsessed with being liked by all of my friends and being cool that I pretty much did whatever it took to do that. Just very sinful, worldly, just hypocrite when it comes to just even the typical things that maybe kids are doing. I was cussing, listening to bad music, treating girls like garbage. I'd become addicted to pornography by about age 13. By age 16, I was trying drugs and I was drinking until the point where I got a DUI and at 16, which was a shock to anyone that knew me because I was so good at hiding who I really was from at least my parents and my family members and coaches but obviously at that point it all kind of came out to the public eye and was super embarrassing, left me pretty broken. Thankfully, that brokenness just so happened to come to a tipping point during a weekend where I had gone to this youth conference that my dad made me go to as a punishment for the DUI and I found myself realizing that, man, my way and my life is clearly not cutting it and I decided to really give the Lord a chance and for the first time that weekend I remember just feeling, really experiencing the power of God, the presence of God, the love of God, the mercy of God, and I repented of my sins truly. For the first time there was sorrow there with it and in one of those kind of you hate to call it a storybook thing, but it kind of was I went down to an altar call or pen into my sins. God really did set me free from a lot of stuff that day and I went home and while the next two years of my high school career weren't perfect by any stretch of the imagination, they were pretty impressive, as it goes with, you know, 16, 17, 18 year olds living for God. You know, living for God in high school, 16, 17, 18-year-olds living for God.
Alex:In high school my relationship with my parents obviously was a lot better. Honestly, man, it was a lifestyle of just seeking God. It was a total flip. All my friends and stuff immediately realized it. From there the rest has been kind of history. I ended up going to ministry school and that's where we met Sam and now I'm in full-time ministry. So that's kind of my origin story. I'm sure there's so much more to unpack. That happened 16 years ago, so there's plenty of stuff to unpack there, but that's sort of my origin story, I guess, yeah, and so I'll go next no-transcript.
Sam:And they gave me a strict curfew and all that. But I just didn't know why I shouldn't do certain things. So I rebelled big time and I lived a very crazy party lifestyle in high school and in cosmetology school and that left me in constant shame, loneliness, depression and anxiety. And then one day I went to a young adult small group and a woman approached me and stopped me and said God told me to tell you that he wants to use your gifts for Him and he has a purpose for you. And right then and there I gave my life to God because I was like heck, yeah, I can live my life for a bigger purpose besides myself, because obviously I was super lonely and sad all the time.
Sam:So I was in and I mean it literally flipped my life upside down and I started living for Jesus and eventually I knew I wanted to be in ministry and so I went to ministry school and then I met Alex there and we were the youth pastors there for a while. So that was pretty cool. And then we moved to Alex's hometown, which is South Fulton, tennessee, very lackluster but, we love it anyways.
Sam:We love his family, which is now my family. Now we reside in Martin, tennessee and Pastor Overflow Church and it is literally the best thing I've ever done in my family. Now we reside in Martin, tennessee and Pastor Overflow Church and it is literally the best thing I've ever done in my life and I cry every other day just thanking God of how great the people are here and even though there's just cornfields and soybeans that because I'm from the beach, so it's like really flipped the script for me. But yeah, it's been great.
Gianina:Yeah, I think what's so cool about both of your stories is that it really wasn't something your family or other people there's nothing that they could have done to convince you like, hey, you need to turn your life around or you need to do this. Or like for you, alex, where your parents could have told you something till they were blue in the face, but it wasn't until God literally shook you and was like, hey, you are mine, I have a purpose for you. And then same with Sam. It was like somebody that you didn't even know that was able to speak that life into you, and it just shows when God has a plan and a purpose for your life, he's going to use anybody and anything to get your attention, and so I think that it's really cool and encouraging, as a mom, that you know I can pray for my kids all day long, which I do, but it's ultimately not up to me. God has a bigger plan and I'm not the one that's in charge of their salvation, so that's really cool.
Alex:Yeah, that's absolutely right it does One person plants, one person waters? But he brings the increase, and that's true for parents as well.
Gianina:That's really good. So I know, whenever you guys filled out your survey for us to do this call one of the things that I was kind of surprised, Alex, when I read you said some of the things that you overcame, which I knew, like people pleasing and addiction and things like that. But I was kind of surprised about bitterness because that doesn't seem like something that I have necessarily witnessed and so I would love you'd be willing to just where that came from and how that maybe affected the decisions that you made and how God made you feel that.
Alex:Yeah, absolutely.
Alex:And man, to know that when you read that you thought you were surprised, that means the Lord's done a real work in me Because there was probably a time period where some of my real close friends would not have echoed that sentiment that you just said, because they would have known exactly the circumstances that led to that, and so that means I've experienced some freedom, which is good to hear. Now Sam is obviously she's a part of this story as well and I'm sure she has her own take but to briefly share during our time in ministry school together. You know and let me preface this by saying I'm a leader out of ministry now and I understand that I've probably caused people heartache and there's probably people that are bitter at me because of things that I've done or things I've said, even unintentionally, or things I didn't even know hurt people, and then they did, and so it is a bit easier for me to extend forgiveness in that regards now because I've lived the life. But when we were there together, there was a very specific time period where, when we were youth pastoring, we didn't have a ton of support from the leaders that were in our lives, that were on paper, called our leaders. There was a lot of moments that we went through that, in the midst of us being imperfect in a million different ways, there's a lot of moments we went through that were a bit unfair and conversations that weren't super fair, things that we were being held accountable for that had never even been communicated leaders, and that's why I'm able to give so much grace, because I'm like I am that, and so it's easier now than it was then.
Alex:But truly the culmination of the story is we'd spent two years pastoring this youth group and specifically when I inherited it, it was a youth group of about 14 kids in a town the size of McKenzie, which no one probably listening even knows what I just said. When I said McKenzie, that's the town our church is in and it's a town of like 3,400 people or maybe 5,600 people. Either way, not very big compared to most towns, very, very extraordinarily small. And so our youth group of 14 kids is probably a pretty normal sized high school youth group for any church and within about two years we had grown that to you might see anywhere from 70 to 85 high school youth group for any church and within about two years we had grown that to you might see anywhere from 70 to 85 high schoolers on a Wednesday night. They're just doing a really good job.
Alex:We had deep connections with those kids. A lot of their parents had started coming to church and were very invested because of those kids, and we'd primarily done all of this without any kind of youth budget and without any oversight. We'd never had a single leader that came to any of our youth functions that was involved in any way. The church really didn't post about it. There was. I mean, the only youth budget we had was whatever me and Sam could afford to give to the youth group, and I had a. You know, youth pastoring was an incredibly part-time position for me and Sam was working a very part-time job as well, and so we just weren't working with much and in the midst of that we weren't very supportive.
Alex:And the only two or three conversations I've really ever had with one of my pastors, let me say this I hired in under one pastor who I still am very close with, who let me do my own thing and was hands-off very intentionally, and after about a year there was a change of positions at the church. That pastor went planted a church, a new person stepped in and underneath this new person I didn't really know them well and there was a bunch of occasions where I was called into meetings about stuff that had been approved or things that had been communicated were okay, and then I would do them and then get in trouble for them, and it just caused a ton of tension in that relationship and it was tension I couldn't fix because, no matter how much we tried to grow that relationship, it wasn't really an option to do so. And so then all of that culminated in a couple of really just intense meetings that then, a few months later, led to us being asked to join a meeting and blindsided and being let go from that position, just being fired. And even in that conversation of being let go, it was very ambiguous and they wouldn't even say the phrase that we were getting fired. It was very like we actually had to ask like so is this, does this mean we don't have a job anymore? Like it was a very tough situation to navigate.
Alex:Of course, all of our closest friends lived in that town. Sam had just opened up a salon in that town and no one told us not to do that, even though they knew that this was in the pipeline. And it ended up being such a dramatic situation that one of the youth girls started a petition in the church and it caused all sorts of drama within the parents of our youth group, because even what was communicated to the parents wasn't the same that was communicated with us. We found ourselves in a position where we were actually asking our parents to respect the leaders of the church and the authority there and to not cause problems, even though we were still hurt.
Alex:And so then of course, we ended up having to move and move in with my parents here in Tennessee, and that was just a really awful season for both of us, especially because before any of that ever happened, we were already struggling. We'd already felt like outcasts. You know, we were on staff with some of these people, but we'd never seen the insides of their houses, we never even had a meeting with them. I mean, it was just such a strange environment. And again, I chalk some of that up to young leadership. But you know, we were even younger, we didn't know how to process some of that stuff and we weren't mature enough to just see some of their flaws and forgive them for it. And then some of that was not. You know, it wasn't fair.
Alex:And so then we've now lost a job, moved back to Tennessee, I'm now living with my parents and my wife and I haven't even been married for an entire year and we're serving at my parents' church and it was like I'll be honest with you that the summer after we got fired there was like a three-week span where we just went on a vacation with my mom and stepdad, a vacation with my dad and stepmom, and then we went to see her parents for a week and it was just a bunch of crying and you'd go from crying to mad to wanting to go get drunk, I mean, you name it. It was just this whirlwind of emotions. And every chance we got to be mad, we did. Every chance we got to be victims, we did. And every chance we got to be sad, we did. And some of that was probably appropriate, and then other, you know, other parts of that were unfair, even to those other people, and so that's kind of where we found ourselves.
Alex:And it was just over the course of time. I don't even know if I can tell you there was a single moment. I know there was for Sam. I know because I remember the moment for her, but I know for me it was mainly just the season. I'll be honest with you, the season that did it for me was getting connected at Overflow because we had moved all the way back and it just kind of felt like man, what in the world's going on? And then, out of nowhere, god just starts working all of these cool things out for our good and I could quickly internalize and look at my life and go. Had all of that not happened, I wouldn't know these people and I wouldn't be in this position, I wouldn't be experiencing what I am right now.
Alex:And also, obviously, being in ministry, you end up being a little bit quicker to forgive people in ministry because you understand that you're probably going to be that person who makes that mistake at some point. Prayers, through many moments of having to get a chair out and visualize an old church leader in that chair and pouring my heart out and being honest to the imaginary person and then forgiving them. You know, over and over Many moments of taking someone's name and writing it on a piece of paper and, in an act of faith, throwing it away. You know, and that on top of just reading the scriptures and seeing how clear Jesus is about his demand for forgiveness and how, you know, you go and you look at the story of the man who doesn't offer forgiveness to the servant who owed him a bunch of money, and it says he ends up being the one that gets thrown in jail. And the idea is that, like bitterness is a self-inflicted prison sentence.
Alex:And I knew that I'd found myself in that. I knew I was in that prison of. I'm mad, I'm bitter, I'm thinking about this when I go to sleep. I can't even follow these people on social media because all I do is get torn up over all of it. And it was a long process, a slow process, but little by little the Lord just kind of rooted some of that out of me.
Alex:And some of it had to do with conversations, you know. Some of it had to do with Alex. You're not allowed to talk bad about these people anymore, alex. You're not allowed to whine about this anymore, alex, you, you know. Then I have to get put in situations where I have to ask for forgiveness from people, and that's real humbling when you have to be the one to say, man, I was wrong here and I shouldn't have done this. It's a lot easier to forgive people that maybe even haven't done that for you but that you know, wish they would, and so yeah, for some of that, that's what it was for me, sam. Do you want to share about your moment there?
Sam:Yeah, I'll just share a small turning point for me. It was whenever we were going back to a conference that they were holding at that same ministry and I was just still so bitter and I was like I just don't want to be there, struggling, being like, are they looking at me? Are they thinking bad things about me? Are they going to show me any attention? Because that's really just what everybody wants from the leaders there, somehow, I don't know. I don't think they brainwashed anybody, I think it's just I don't know Somehow the culture does that to you.
Sam:But I remember Alex looking me in the face, being like you know, they're human, right? I'm like, yes, dang it. So I can't hold them to a higher standard than I do myself. Because, like now that I'm in a pastoral position, I know I've hurt people and a pastor told me one time I'm sure it's in the scripture somewhere, I'm not sure where, but it's you sow mercy to reap mercy. I'm like, gosh, okay, I need to sow a lot of mercy because I'm going to have to reap a lot of mercy.
Gianina:So that's it for me, though. Yeah. Yeah, I think one thing that you said, that you hit on, that I've really been learning this year is that when you hold on to bitterness or offense or hurt from one situation, it doesn't have to be anything where a lot of people are hurting you, but when you're holding it from one situation, you will find it in everything. Every person is going to offend you, every situation is going to offend you, and I've had conversations with people even this year where they come to me and they're like well, this person hurt me and this person did that, and this person did that. And I'm like I can only tell you this because I literally went through it the last two years is, when you're operating from a place of hurt, you're going to be hurt by everything.
Gianina:And so it's so interesting when you were saying that about you know being offended when you guys came back home and going on vacation and just like kind of being mad at everything, and I think that's so important for people to realize like, if you are in a place right now where you're, you feel like you're hurt by everyone, everyone's offending you, everyone's against you. I would really challenge you to search your heart and pray and say like what bitterness am I holding onto that I need to let go of, because it's absolutely so freeing when you do.
Alex:It is, it is. You know, we say this all the time Bitterness is like drinking poison and expecting it to hurt the other person Like. That's not how that works. You know, if you're holding, on to it.
Kiley:you're the one that's going to lose sleep. You're the one that's going to lose friendships. You're the one that's going to give up moments of your day where you should be hanging out with your kids and your family members, and instead you're thinking about these people who hurt you and let you down.
Alex:Meanwhile you're probably hurting someone and letting someone down. And not only that the person that you're thinking about is probably not thinking about you at all. They literally, and most of the time that's what we've laughed about. So it's like so funny we're in a season where now we laugh about that because we're like they're literally not thinking about it.
Sam:It's not because they're even bad people, it's because that didn't hurt them, so of course they're not thinking about that I think I was also dealing with a lot of main character syndrome, where I thought they were just like losing sleep over how much they didn't like me or how much I like ruined the ministry of theirs or something I don't know. I was just creating all these fake scenarios in my head and then I would have this voice in my head.
Alex:That's like in the nicest way they do not care about you, they do not care about you and I'm like dang, yeah, you're right, they're thinking about their families, they're thinking about the friends that are mad at them, they're thinking about people who've hurt them, and they're literally not thinking about you at all. That's something me and Sam love talking about is main character syndrome just how it feels like our entire generation has main character syndrome. It's just like everyone is against them and every story has to be about them, and you know it's like, oh, chill out, dude.
Kiley:One of the things that I thought was really good that you mentioned was that there's a lot of people that experience that church hurt. I was in a type of leadership position a long time ago and stuff happened and I won't get into it right now, but for some people it would be enough for them to not want to return to church, and so one of the things I was thinking of when you were telling your story was, first of all, I thought okay, god had a major plan for you guys. You were already being attacked that early on in your marriage somebody did not want what God had for you. The other thing that you mentioned is that people are human. So any you know I've grown up with the belief that it is.
Kiley:It's about the relationship. It's not about the religion or the church, because religion is made by man. The church is, has it's run by humans and humans make things, and something like this would make a lot of people want nothing to do with church. But I think if they get past that and I'm sure that we probably will have some listeners who have experienced something like that and haven't stepped foot in a church because of something that happened to them but I think if they can focus on the relationship that they have with Christ and realize that people are human and they're going to make mistakes, then hopefully that darkness will be lifted a little bit. It'll make them open to coming back and experiencing, you know, the fulfillment that God has for them.
Alex:Yeah, you know, of course I'll second that and say not to. You know, I don't want to invalidate anything that anyone's suffered through or been through at the hands of church leaders because I mean, there are sincerely some really really awful scenarios out there that are very true and very real. But, as everyone who had ever listened to this also knows, there are a lot of scenarios out there that we lose our minds over and allow ourselves to stay hurt over, that are really honestly silly, because I only say that because when I've been there to have done it. But, like I say, sometimes it's silly because we wouldn't take the same approach in any other area of our life. You know, I know a lot of people who would quickly identify as church hurt because of a scenario. But in the same way, they've gone to McDonald's 14 times in the month and the order's been wrong every time and they've never identified as McDonald's hurt. But literally McDonald's has let them down and taken their money every time. Same at Walmart They've had to deal with horrible buggies and terrible customer service. Walmart took away people that back our groceries. Now we have to do it ourselves and no one's Walmart hurt and they keep going back to Walmart, and that situation could go on and on and on. But it's like you have one negative experience at church or a long-term negative experience with one person and suddenly now the entire church has let you down, the whole universal, global body of Christ has let you down, and it's like, hey, come on, man, like I bet if we asked that person about their experience with you, I bet they wouldn't have positive things to say all the way around. You know, and then you know.
Alex:The other thing I would mention is like one of the things we're learning through some of that is that there's an equal mixture, because you mentioned like the enemy was attacking us early on in our marriage. We're learning that there's an equal mixture of human, god and enemy in almost every event that you go through. You know. You see it with Jesus on the cross, like people nailed him to the cross. The enemy obviously wanted him on the cross, but like God wanted him the cross, and you see this three-strand cord at work there.
Alex:I mean I can definitely say that about our experience. People let us down in terms of the relational aspect. The enemy wanted to use that circumstance to absolutely get us so offended and distracted, but at the same time, god used it to get us right where we needed to be. I mean, I can't say this about Sam because as a 16-year-old, her dream wasn't being in West Tennessee pastoring a super thriving church, but that was my dream. I have had to relearn and figure out what my biggest dreams are because we're living them right now, and God used that painful circumstance to not only get us here, but to get us ready for this and to teach us. And so it was like this equal part of the enemy, humans and God all at work at the same time.
Gianina:Yeah, it's very cool. Well, sam, I would love to hear a little bit about your perspective and, like Alex just mentioned, some of your dreams and things that you want to see happen. And I know some of the things that we've talked about are like being afraid of what other people think, and do you think that some of that church hurt played into that, or is that something you've kind of struggled with your whole life, and where are you at with that right now?
Sam:Absolutely. So I was only a year saved, maybe going to ministry school, and so, like I said, I didn't grow up in church. And all these other kids that were there grew up in church, like they knew how to tell their testimony. I didn't even know what a testimony was, literally had no clue. I didn't know how to pray for people. I remember I could OK, so I grew up dancing no-transcript and I finally learned how to do that, but I still had never, like, prayed in front of people. And so I remember somebody handing me the mic. It was Pastor Micah and he was like, all right, would you just pray over everybody after you did your dance or whatever. After you did your dance or whatever, and I was like, yeah, lord, bless them In Jesus name, amen. So embarrassing, but no one took the time to teach me.
Sam:Going back to childhood, I always got made fun of when I was in school because I wasn't very book smart, but I also wasn't very good at speaking in front of people, and especially if I had to read out loud it was terrible. So when I got saved, I did feel like a lot of that broke off of me, even though, like I said, in ministry school I had a lot to learn and I did eventually have some people teach me. But it was very hard at first because I wasn't used to it. But right when I got saved I would always speak Galatians 2.20 over me and just for a refresher, it says my old self has been crucified with Christ. It is no longer I who live, but Christ that lives in me. So I live in this earthly body by trusting in the Son of God who loved me and gave himself for me and the pressure on me was off and I got to depend on him. And that was the most freeing thing in the whole world. Because also, I identify as socially awkward sometimes and so talking in front of people or just talking to people in general was so nerve wracking for me. And it was like when I would think about that verse and also like listen to the Holy Spirit and be like, okay, holy Spirit, give me the words to say like I'm fully depending on you. It was this freeing feeling and yeah, I would still sound stupid sometimes, but it was more so like I didn't have the anxiety anymore and I didn't have this weird pressure on me.
Sam:So to this day I mean, I mainly just do the announcements at church, nothing too crazy. But sometimes I'll like pray us out of worship and stuff. And it's really important to me that I hear from the Lord in those moments, because I feel like those moments are for like prophetic moments for people in the room that need to hear from God. And a lot of times I will get nervous but then I'm like, okay, first of all it's not about me the whole main character syndrome. I'm like what are people going to think of me? What if I mess up a word? What if I sound silly or stupid? And then I'm like, wait, it's not about me. So that's like the first thing I remember. But also I go to that birth. That's like his yoke is easy and his burden is light and that's all he asks me to carry. And so that's what I've been carrying with me through this season of my life, because I have been dealing with a lot of fear and anxiety.
Gianina:And.
Sam:I don't know if I just like picked it back up along the way, because for a while I was doing great and then all of a sudden I was like I guess, honestly, me and Janita were talking about it the other day. It's whenever I became a mom.
Gianina:And it was like it's motherhood.
Sam:Yes, and I'm like gosh now. I'm just anxious about everything and I know the Bible says not to be, but how do you do that.
Kiley:It's very hard not to be when you're a parent.
Sam:Yes, so, and gosh, he's one and a half, so he's, you know, running and jumping in puddles and bumping his head and eating things off the floor. He's not supposed to. So of course, I have anxiety about that, but also, it's just, I'm just anxious, Like, and I I feel like I've developed this, this way of thinking. That's like I give into my anxiety and I give into my fear and I let it spiral before I can get a hold of it, and then my body reacts like I've. I've had more panic attacks this past year than I've ever had in my life. I don't think I've ever had one before until this year.
Sam:So, but I was at um the Kerygma conference with Janina this past weekend and um, carrie Jobe was singing oh my gosh, I'm so glad you're saying it and um, carrie joe was singing for this story oh my gosh, I'm so glad you're saying it. So, uh, carrie joe was singing, and on the way there I. So backstory the first encounter with god I ever had was to revelation song by carrie joe, and it was after I, like, left a dude's house in 10th grade. Like I said, I didn't grow up in church. I had no idea anything about christian music, like literally no idea. And I happened to turn it literally no idea. And I happened to turn it to Caleb and I was like, oh, this is a slow song. I'm really sad, so maybe it'll like make me feel better somehow, or I can just cry to it.
Sam:And then the power of God meets me in my car and I'm just weeping and I have no idea even what to do with it. Okay, because I'm like I don't have a pastor in my life to tell me what this means, but I know the Lord is in there with me. So, anyways, on the way to the conference, I'm like Lord, if Carrie Jobe sings a Revelation song, you see me, you're with me, and so the second song she sings is a Revelation song. Because in my head I'm like this is such an old song she's not going to sing it. She has so many other songs. So I'm like weeping. I'm like, oh my gosh, you see me and he's like no, not only do I see you, I know you. And he's like I want to get down in the nitty gritty with you. And then he shows me a picture of the woman caught in adultery and of course I'm the woman and he's. I'm like you know, punch to the gut. And I'm like, but in the best way. I'm like yes, thank you for pointing that out to me.
Sam:And so another reason I've been dealing with fear is because I've been having some like heart issues, and at the time I was wearing a heart monitor and I was having some like heart racing, heart palpitations, that type thing and also anxiety. So then at the end of the song okay, this is very important because it was during this song, the Revelation song and she's like I just feel like I need to pray for anybody in here who's been dealing with fear and anxiety. You know, like we just pray against that. And then all of a sudden she says and anybody dealing with heart palpitations? I just declare that gone in Jesus name.
Sam:And I wanted to like obviously it's a women's conference, so this would probably be appropriate, but I just want to rip my shirt off and show her my heart monitor and be like it's me, because it was so insane. I like was about to run around the room, I don't know. It was so crazy and it was like gosh. Even through all those moments where I cheated on the Lord with fear, he was still there. He was still riding in the sand, still riding in the dirt, saying like no, I love you and you're worthy of my love, and like I'm not, I didn't leave you. Even though you feel this way, like I didn't, I've never left you.
Alex:So that was so cool.
Sam:But and that's like a story, especially since that happened. I've been taking that through my life just in the past week, and every time I feel fear creep up and I'm like no, no, no, you said that you're, even if I feel this, like you're not scared of it and you're like down in the dirt with me. So pretty cool.
Gianina:It reminds me of when Jesus was in the boat with the disciples and they're freaking out and he's like do you know who I am? And so now, even sometimes when I travel, I get anxiety, which I never used to until I became a mom. And then it's like what if something happens to me? You know, and Kingston's going to be back, and so I just picture Jesus saying I'm in the boat with you, like I am in this boat with you.
Gianina:You are going to be okay, because it is a real thing, real thing honestly, and I know I said this when we were at the conference too it's. I hear so many women say they struggle with anxiety, to the point where I'm angry, I'm so mad at the devil that he thinks this is the story that he can write over women's lives, because I would say 99% of women I know have either struggled with anxiety or struggle with anxiety currently, and so it just I don't know. He's not that creative, and so I feel like he puts the same fears in all of our minds, that it's annoying, and I am over it and just like ready to take back our freedom that we have in God, because, yeah, it's so good.
Kiley:What I would first like to ask you both is you feel like you're in a valley season or a victory each one of you? And then, if you are feeling like you are in different seasons, how do you navigate that as?
Alex:a couple. Personally, I do feel like I'm in a victory season right now. That's a weird question to ask me, though, because he's always in a victory season.
Sam:It's super annoying.
Alex:That's what I was about to say. I don't normally identify as someone who's in a valley season. I mean literally I just told you the one season of my life where I felt like that, outside of when Sam had a miscarriage, when she went through a miscarriage I think we both felt that for a second, Literally outside of that, I can't tell you. I've ever identified as not being in a victory season and that's not some kind of like overly faith churchy thing. I'm just very naturally a glass half full optimistic person by nature.
Sam:Do y'all watch, friends.
Alex:Yeah, yes.
Sam:Do you remember that one boyfriend Phoebe had? That was like super positive all the time.
Alex:Yeah.
Sam:That's Alex.
Alex:To a fault, it is me. To a fault, it is me.
Kiley:Same thing I, you know, I always try to see good in people. And the glass is half full, okay, it can always be worse. You know we're, we're good, we're, we're alive, breathing, we're living. Another day it's good.
Alex:So there's my answer to that question.
Sam:Okay and I feel like I just got out of a valley season. But I'm in a victory season currently, and I think it was just with all the anxiety that I was in a valley season. I struggled to get pregnant for about three years and that was like the lowest I think I've ever been in my life. And then I had a miscarriage, which brought me even lower I didn't know you could get any lower than that, but I did and then, once I had Roman, all this anxiety started. So I just feel like for the past five years I've been struggling and then just recently I feel like the Lord has like not given me permission, because I think he's been giving me permission, but I feel like I've. I've given him permission to come in and heal a lot of things in me and now he's like helping me start to dream again about, you know, things in my life that I would like to do and ministry stuff and all that. So that's that's what I see whenever I think of like a victory season is like okay, we're dreaming again.
Gianina:Yeah, ooh, I like that.
Gianina:So how do you navigate when you guys are kind of in different seasons?
Gianina:Because I I feel like that's such a common thing in marriages and I didn't realize that before I got married where, you know, you assume like, oh, we're both saved, we're both Christians, we're both following the Holy Spirit, we're reading our Bibles, we're praying, we're just going to go the same direction all of our lives and be on fire for God, and then one person is dealing with something and the other person's on a high and then the other person finally gets out of whatever they're going through, and then you're going through something you know and it's hard to kind of navigate.
Gianina:That I have found, at least like in my own life, in my own marriage, where it's very I don't want to say it's very rare that we're on the same page. But I feel like up until now, more often than not, we were kind of yin and yang, like just different, and trying to navigate how to support each other in that. And so I would love your insight on, like, obviously, alex, if you're going through the glass half full and there's not really anything super traumatic happening in your life, sam's going through a hard time you don't want to be like. Well, sorry about your luck.
Alex:You know like I'm doing great yeah, I think my my biggest learning curve there has been learning how to shut my mouth. Honestly. Uh, I'm very quick to not in such dramatic terms, but to just say why don't you just get over it? Well, you know, I would never actually say that phrase.
Alex:No, I think he did, maybe and maybe because in my mind, maybe I would never say that now for sure, but it would be very strange if I did. But I was always like, well, let's just be happy today, which it doesn't work, and I totally get that Especially with a woman.
Gianina:I know that's what. Sam is saying Like why are you? Or like don't be mad, like don't ever.
Alex:Don't be be happier. I mean, you know it's like that's so not helpful.
Alex:I've had to learn how to ask questions and I've had to learn how to not try to find my identity in fixing. Sam, I am such a fixer. I want to solve every problem. I want to be the answer to every problem and my name is not Jesus Christ and so I can't do that. I am actually not the answer to any problem and I, on my own, I don't have the power to solve anything, and I used to take that burden on myself. When she was having a bad day, I internalized this is the story I told myself was she's not happy because she's not happy with me. And that's not true. It's like it had nothing to do with me. In fact, all I mean now, once I once I was about to say once I tried to remedy the problem, then she was not happy because she was not happy with me.
Alex:But before that I started finding the beauty and saying hey, how are you doing today? I've noticed that you're down and her telling me honest answer and me going I'm so sorry you're feeling like that. Is there anything I can do to help? And just asking, is there anything I can do to help? And if she says no, then I'm going to pray for her and then I'm just going to love her and I'm going to keep fixing the food or do whatever it is that we're doing.
Alex:But I don't know. I think I was assuming that I was like she was mad at me or, because I couldn't help get her out of it, that I was doing something wrong, or sometimes I was just annoyed. Sometimes I was just annoyed and there was other seasons of our life where I was her venting station and I was getting a lot more vents than I was positive things, and so there were moments where, yeah, to Sam's credit, she also learned how to take some of that to the Lord before just dumping it all on me. I don't know if you wanted to say anything to that.
Sam:Yeah, and I think for me, being in a valley season while he was in a victory season, I had to realize that I couldn't just think about myself all the time and I would have to meet him at his highs and have fun with him in order to like not to keep him happy, but like I wanted to do that because I love him. You know, and if I was just thinking about me all the time we me and Alex call it way way being a way way. So if I was a way way all the time, then obviously that was just really selfish. And if he had something exciting going on in his life and I was just like, yeah, well, my life sucks, then that's not good for him. You know, like if I was having fun and excited about something and he was sad about something else, like I would still want him to celebrate me.
Sam:So that's something I had to learn over the past few years, and it was not easy. I was definitely not very good at it, but I think eventually I came around and I noticed those moments a little bit more.
Alex:I've heard, I've heard, I heard I did not make this up I heard, and y'all probably heard this before, but people will say that marriage is 50-50 and it's like that's not true at all. Sometimes one person has 10% to bring to the table and the other person has to make up the other 90. And then there's going to be seasons where the person who brought the 90, they only have 15% and the other person is going to have to bring 85 in.
Alex:And it's definitely not always 50-50. And I had to, in the same way that she had to learn how to, almost just like, climb that mountain with me, I had to learn how to get down to the valley with her. And if she needed me to just sit there and not try to fix her and just like hug her and whatever, just to do that and to quit trying to fix her, she would always look at me and she'd say, okay, thanks, pastor, it's so funny, but that's like now, that's now a language that we use. She'll say I don't need you to be Pastor Alex right now, I just need you to be husband. But then the other day she goes. It was great, she goes. I'm actually not looking for husband Alex, I need Pastor Alex right now.
Alex:And I was like oh, my time to shine. I was so happy. I was like I haven't heard this one before.
Kiley:I think that's so cool because as you go through your marriage, you definitely have different seasons of learning just more about each other and how to react to each other. But I think what you guys are talking about and describing are those attributes of Jesus. He meets people where they're like, he gets down into the nitty gritty with them and he celebrates their victories with them, and so I know that there's been. At the beginning of my marriage, my husband was the same way. He just wanted to fix things. And I I we eventually got to the point where if I'm not having a great day, he can tell, and I said I don't want you to say anything, I don't need you to fix anything, Just hold me and let me cry. And he's like you know, and sometimes you know, just as you grow together, you just learn more about each other, and that is the relationship that we have with Jesus too.
Gianina:Yeah, so you guys are the first married couple that we have on the show. I would love to pick your brain about something. So when you said that and you said sometimes one person is giving 90 percent and one person is giving 10. What does it practically look like when both only have 10% to give? What practically like? Obviously, I know the spiritual churchy answer is like, okay, we'll just give it to God and just pray. But what does that actually look like to give it to God, how would you navigate? Because I know you guys went through that season with your miscarriage where it was such a hard time for both of you and I know community was something that was important. But what are some practical ways that a couple, a married couple that don't have I mean, they don't even have enough to give themselves, let alone each other how they can navigate that?
Sam:I think for me it was just surrounding myself with people, not just over text but in person, asking, not being afraid to ask people to come over, or me being like, hey, can I come over? I'm not doing well and Alex isn't the person I need right now. I know that sounds mean, but it's like he was kind of already over it and I wasn't Not over, but he, he had kind of worked through it a little bit sooner than I did and I just wasn't doing well mentally at all and I was like I just need to get out of the house, I need to go somewhere, I need to be with my friends. And I will say my friends really came through for me in that way and it was like we could joke and then we would have a serious moment of crying and then we'd go back to joking and I think that really just healed me.
Alex:And yeah gosh, I second that. But for me it was a little bit different. It wasn't just community in terms Now, this is not what she's saying, because I know what her community is so healthy and awesome it wasn't just community in terms of being around other people. I had to actually access the community that was available in terms of being vulnerable around other people.
Alex:There were years, early, early on in my role as pastor at Overflow Church, where I'm not sure any of my friends or any of our staff or leaders ever heard me say one negative thing about my life, say one thing that I was struggling with. When I say I was glass half full to a fault, that's what I mean. I literally did not talk about things that were stressing me out. I internalized them, I did take them to the Lord, but I also needed to confess that stuff to people. I needed to talk about it. Or if I was struggling in some way whether it was bitterness or lust or with our marriage, you name it I mean there's healing in confession. James has a lot to say about that.
Alex:Confess your sins and be healed, and maybe sometimes the sins there just looks like this anxiety that you are feeding, and I wouldn't talk to anyone about that, and the biggest difference between me and Sam is that it's not that like when she talks about needing that community. She needed women first of all, which I am not, and she needed someone that's not me. The thing is, though, she had to leave to go, find that, go to their houses, because I have that. All day long, I work with some of my closest friends, I'm with them, I'm able to have conversations with those people out loud, and what a tool, what a gift that is to work with the people, and a part of my job is moments like that, whereas her job was not that she's going to the salon and having part of my job is moments like that, you know, whereas her job was not that she's going to the salon and having to cater to clients who just care about their balayage, and not her life.
Sam:I will say some of my work, not my co-workers, but my clients were so sweet, like they brought me flowers. They were like take your time, Like if you don't need to come back for a while, that's okay, like I'll wait. And you know most people were like no, I need my roots done. Like tomorrow, I need them done yesterday. I don't care about you, but my clients were actually so gracious in that and that was actually a part of the community that really helped me through that.
Alex:So yeah, you know, I'll just second in saying that that looks so different. Girls need someone to cry with.
Gianina:Yeah.
Alex:Not that I didn't need that, but I needed people that were going to. I needed a dude that was actually going to say, hey, how are you doing, Are you okay? And me being able to say I'm mad, I'm upset, I'm not feeling anything, I don't know. Or also, I needed guys to go play basketball with, yeah, and some of that was really important to me during that season, having people like that in my corner. But you know, I just don't. I.
Alex:What I don't understand is how married people that don't have friends last. I'll never understand that, because for me and Sam, you know, the percentage of how much are we with our friends versus each other is like a 95 to five. But those five, that 5% of just being with our friends, is such a big deal, Like it's huge. We need that so much. And then we went on a lot of walks together as well during that season. A lot of walks together, a lot of handholding, a lot of movie nights, a lot of ice cream and I had dogs at the time and they really helped they did, and it's like those are not the seasons to like really watch your calories and try to get fit.
Alex:Those are just the seasons to eat, to eat taco bell and be sad together, yeah yeah, I mean I had to. I didn't know how to grieve, I never, I never learned how to do any of that stuff, and so I had to learn how to do that with her and and I hope any of that was valuable, like I hope that even scratched the surface of answering, coming close to answering that question, janina.
Gianina:Yeah, for sure. I think, even what you just said about learning how to grieve. I think that's so important because most people fall into one of two categories, where they either sweep things under the rug and don't deal with anything, or they just isolate and you don't know how to reach out. And I think if any of our listeners are in one of those camps, this is a moment to just say, okay, this is where I'm at right now, and now I just have to learn how to process, learn how to grieve. It's okay that I'm grieving, let me learn how to do it in a way that's going to help me and my kids or my family members in the long run. So that's really powerful, yeah.
Kiley:So what's a fun or unexpected way that God has shown up in your marriage or family recently?
Alex:A fun or unexpected way that God has shown up in our marriage or our family. Raising a one-year-old will really do that for you.
Gianina:Well that's unexpected, you know every day.
Alex:Well, it's expected, because you knew it was coming for nine months. What is unexpected is, every month the child changes so much that right when you think you have it down and you've figured it out, you have to learn a whole new control system.
Alex:Everything is brand new all the time, but that has been a lot of fun and it has been fun watching Sam become such a really cool and fun and caring mom.
Alex:It's been fun for me personally getting to be an intentional and fun dad. I've had a lot of moments where probably more so than most dads where it's me and him and it's because of the nature of her work hours. She's working till late, whether she's choreographing for a local sorority or at the salon until 8.30 or 9,. There are a lot of days where I get the opportunity to wake him up, take him to the sitter, pick him up, hang out with him, especially at the beginning of the week. She's working Monday, tuesday, wednesday, right now and so in a lot of those days it's just me and him for a long period of time, and I don't feel like most dads get that. I don't feel like their lives are set up in a way where they even can do that, and so it's been really cool for me getting to have those opportunities to learn that and watch my selfishness just dissipate because of you can't be selfish and effectively raise a child. It literally has to be all about them and effectively raise a child.
Alex:It literally has to be all about them, even in terms of not getting to watch as much basketball, as I want to watch, because I'm watching Miss Rachel instead, and so I don't know for me if I'm thinking about an unexpected thing. It's like the part of child rearing that makes you holy, if you let it. You know you could just be mad or frustrated all the time, or it's like Lord, what are you doing in me right now? What are you rooting out of me right now?
Alex:And I've seen myself scrolling a lot less on social media and watching a lot less TV, because I'm, you know we're, we're getting to go on walks together or play outside or I don't know different stuff like that. So that's an unexpected blessing. Anything from you, Sam, she, she, she echoes the same sentiment.
Gianina:Well, I have a question for Sam. Here's a here's like. Kind of a fun one is is there anything that you have learned about the character of God through being a parent? Because God obviously refers to himself a lot as a father Is there anything you've learned about his character through being a parent? Because for me that's the most fun part when I am doing something and how I'm teaching Kingston or connecting with him and I'm like that's what God meant when he said that yes, Well, god is way more patient than me, that's for sure, and so Roman can't really like communicate well yet.
Sam:So I feel like I haven't really gotten the stage of, like you know, teaching him wise things. The Lord has brought me through, or something you know. But he started hitting me in the face currently just like slapping me and saying ow and I think he learned that from daycare Like some other kid slapped him and was like ow, I don't know. And so in those moments I'm like okay, how am I going to react? Because my first reaction is like I'm going to hit him back, you know, and I'm going to say ow and see how he feels, but, like you know, he's hitting me in the face. I'm like, do I really want to do that? I don't know. And then I'm like, okay, well, what would the lord do? And then I have to sit there and process it. I can't even give you an answer to what that answer is right now, because I don't know and he hits me in the face all the time.
Sam:So I still haven't figured it out. I just sit there and think and I'm like, okay, I'm just not gonna react like I don't know. So I'm starting to learn more and more of like how to. It's like those initial reactions to whenever they do something wrong or bad, or I'm like saying no and I'm raising my voice. I'm like, ooh, would the Lord raise his voice?
Gianina:at me like that.
Sam:You know, like I'm way worse than Romans being right now, and the Lord has never just screamed and, you know, whack me with his staff, or something. So, I think that's been, that's been the hardest thing for me, but also the most joyful, because I'm like, no, I want to raise him in the way of the Lord, you know, and like the way the Lord has raised me in my new life with Christ. So for sure.
Kiley:I remember when I first became a mom, like it didn't matter how long of a day or frustrating of a day I had with her. It was always that very next morning when she woke up and everything was new and fresh. And I look at her and I'm like, oh my gosh, she's mine. I feel like that's how God sees us too. It's like no matter what kind of stuff we go through in a day or what decisions we make, and he may be really, really frustrated with us, but I promise you that several years down the road, when he's no longer watching Miss Rachel, you will hear the theme song or whatever it is, and it will. Just, you may not remember the basketball games that you've seen, but you will remember those moments. So absolutely.
Alex:I believe it with my whole heart.
Sam:And Roman actually does like basketball.
Alex:He does. He'll sit and watch basketball with me whole heart, and Roman actually does like basketball. He does.
Sam:He'll sit and watch basketball with me sometimes and shoot the basketball himself and say yeah.
Kiley:I mean just a little fun side thing. My daughter is 15 now and she grew up watching Elmo's Singing with the Stars. She'll probably kill for this, but I picked her up from school the other day and she was just in. I don't know, I don't know if she the other day and she was just in, I don't know, I don't know if she was tired or if she was just in a bad mood, but I found the singing with the stars on YouTube and it like put the biggest smile on oh my gosh, I remember this.
Sam:It's like that nostalgic comfort.
Kiley:Yes, she, she is, very she is. She's my nostalgic one, like she, just anything from her childhood she hangs on to and I said, yeah, don't you wish you could go back to those days, because she's in high school now and it's not as fun, right no?
Gianina:it's funny. Yeah, one of my things with Kingston when he was little. He didn't really go through like much of a biting or hitting stage, but one time he bit me. We, you know like how you kind of nibble on their fingers a little bit. So I was like nibbling on his fingers and he's like, oh, that looks like fun, let me nibble on your fingers and like bit the crap out of me and I started crying because it hurt so bad. And then he starts crying because he feels horrible for hurting me and he never did it again. So maybe try crying, just like start bawling and see if it works.
Sam:I do. You know, I have, I've faked, I've like fake cried and he starts laughing at me. So I'm like these were real tears, yeah.
Kiley:Okay, you'll cry. Yeah, you have to real cry Okay.
Sam:Okay, I'll try to muster up a tear next time.
Kiley:So, being new parents, I know there's house on Friday, every Friday, obviously that she can keep him.
Sam:But that has been so amazing because it just gives me a second to like miss Roman but, also gives me a time to be like fully intentional with Alex.
Sam:Yeah, and because I'm I have severe ADD, like very bad. And so whenever me and Alex are having like a deep conversation and Roman's running around getting into stuff, like I'm looking at him, I'm looking at Alex, I'm looking at Roman, I'm looking at Alex just to make sure everything's like okay. But Alex is like pay attention to me. So whenever we have Fridays, I always make sure like okay, this is my time that I can love him in this way, because he values eye contact very much. So, like you're not going to be distracted, I'm going to have this conversation, even if it's a pointless conversation. I want you to pay attention to what I'm saying and that's the way I love him on fridays that's all.
Alex:Yeah, um, you know, same and I'll. We've been so intentional with that that on day seven he stayed with my mom. He stayed with my mom, he had been alive for seven days and it was a Friday and we sent him over there on day seven because we, from the jump, wanted to be intentional about. We have got to keep us a priority in this thing and I thought that was a really good precedent that we set from the beginning, even though some people are like, dude, day seven is your first kid giving him away. Like I get that.
Alex:That is really insane for some people to hear. But at the same time, that kid is going to leave us one day and we're not going to leave us one day he's going to move on and go find bigger and better things and then we're going to be stuck here with just us. And if we don't have a great friendship when he's gone, then we will look at each other and go, oh my gosh, I'm a living with him. Yeah, they never wanted that. And so date nights you know I was going to say that it's going to sound like a really typical guy answer, but it's worth saying because she took my answer and date nights. We our sex lives too.
Alex:I don't know if that's even allowed for me to say you can cut that out of this podcast if you want to.
Kiley:Hey it's Whatever we're, you know that's. I fully agree this is real.
Alex:In my opinion, this is just as helpful If you're married. This is just as helpful as anything else, but we've been intentional about that in terms of even make sure it's scheduled Not that that's the only time it can happen, but we are intentional about that. And if you want a happy marriage, I just don't see how that could not exist and it be truly a happy marriage. It has to be a part of it and that requires lots of things like intentionality and forgiveness and whatever. But I just hear too many stories.
Alex:As a pastor, I hear a whole lot of stories from men and women. Both who had kids, got busy, quit having sex and now it's such an issue in their home and it is a subject of deep bitterness and resentment and that just simply doesn't have to be the case and it shouldn't be the case, and we've made that a priority and so that's been, I think, helpful for both of us. Of course me, the dude I'm the one over here talking about this, but I don't know. I don't hear enough people say that Like, hey, we kept having sex. I hear way more people say we quit doing that and I go well, no wonder y'all aren't Somewhere along the way. That's a part of being intentional.
Gianina:It's an important part of being a married couple.
Alex:Yeah, God seems to think it's pretty important. He said it from the very beginning and there's an entire book of the Bible called the Song of Songs talking about sexuality, Like if he's going to write a whole book about it and talk about it from like Genesis. I'm thinking if that's one of his priorities, surely it has to be one of ours.
Kiley:And I think it's so important you do. You have kids, you get busy, life happens and without that intentionality, things go south really quick. And I hear a lot about people who schedule date nights and schedule things around their sex life as well, and I think it's important to know that it's not always going to be that super, super romantic, but it's still. It's still that moment of connection for the two of you, you know, and, like you said, it doesn't just have to be on those nights, but as long as it is, you know you, you are aware of that and you have intentions and you stick with those intentions, it makes a huge difference.
Gianina:I heard someone say one time that every time that you're intimate as a married couple, you're renewing your vows with that person, and I think that's such an important perspective to think about and to look at, because I mean, really you're making that union again and you're becoming one again and you're making that commitment over. So I think that's really good.
Alex:Yes.
Gianina:Yeah, all right.
Gianina:So I would love it if you guys would be willing to pray for our listeners.
Gianina:And this has been a really fun episode and I'm really excited about that because we've had just a lot of heavy episodes the last couple months, which I think are equally as important and needed. But it's just really fun to bring balance of, like your positivity and just things that are happening in your life, and so I think that's really cool, and even Sam being willing to share your story and then to say like, hey, god did this. I think it's really cool to think about the timing of even podcast and being able to share that of like, hey, literally two weeks ago, this is where I was at and this is what God did in my life and being. And so I think, if I can ask you guys to pray for someone who's in that place where maybe you were two weeks ago where they just need that touch of God, they just need him to intervene in their life and they're at that point of like, okay, god, do you see me? Do you still care about me? So if you wouldn't mind praying for that, I would absolutely love it.
Sam:Okay, well, lord, I thank you so much for everybody listening and I thank you that every single person is so special to you and it's not like a for God, so love the world special, it's like no, I know every here on your head special. And I thank you that every single part of our lives it means something to you, like you care about it, no matter how minuscule and little it is, and I thank you that you're not mad at us. I'm just going to include myself in this prayer and I thank you that you're kind and merciful, even though a lot of times you know the things that we're like. God, do you see me? A lot of times it's because we've distanced ourselves from you. And first of all, I just want everybody to repent with me for that, lord. We repent for hiding from you, like Adam and Eve in the garden. They hid from you because they were shameful. I just break off any shame off of anybody listening right now that you would be able to come out of hiding and seek the Lord and know that he's good and know his voice.
Sam:Pray for every single person listening that you would be able to hear that still small voice over that chaotic screaming. All the thoughts, all the craziness of the fear and anxiety, all of those voices in your head. I pray that they would cease and they would no longer be a priority in your life. I thank you that, lord, you are coming through for people in that way that they would begin to hear the voices fizzle out and hear your voice become louder, and I pray that you would even start giving them dreams and visions, and I thank you that their story is not over.
Sam:I just saw a book opening to a page halfway in the book and I feel like that's for somebody out there that your story isn't over, that this isn't the peak of your saved life and that you still have that God still has a plan for you. I know that sounds so cliche and Christian-y, but God still has a plan for you and, lord, I thank you that it's a fun, exciting plan. It's not just a plan full of anxiety and fear, but it's a plan full of joy and excitement. So, lord, I thank you for every single person listening. I pray a special blessing over them. They would feel your presence so strongly in their life that you would let them know in your own kind of way that they can receive best, that you see them and that you know them and that you're down to get in the nitty gritty with them.
Alex:And Lord, I have no idea how I could possibly add anything more beautiful or poetic to that, and so I will just quickly pray for the person who feels like they have a little cloud that's following them around and they just feel gloomy and like it's just raining on them. Thank you for the word that you spoke to me today. You reminded me that april showers bring may flowers, and we pray that, even though they may feel a little gloomy, a little bit like there's just that little thundercloud following them, that on the other side of that there's fruit and there's something beautiful, and that you are the God who makes beautiful things possible. In Jesus name, amen.
Kiley:Amen.
Gianina:So good.
Kiley:Sam and Alex, thank you so much for your honesty and your vulnerability and just for letting us into your story, just through that fear and anxiety, to learning how to navigate the tension of Valley and Victory as a couple.
Kiley:Your words carry so much hope for those listening and we just we appreciate you being on with us tonight. If you are tuning in today and you find yourself in a hard place, maybe you're in your own Valley season. We want you to know this. God is not distant. He is present, he is working, even when it feels quiet, and you are not alone. If something from today's episode spoke directly to your heart, we'd love for you to share it, send it to a friend, leave a review or connect with us on social, and be sure to follow the podcast so you don't miss future episodes. Until next time, keep walking, keep trusting and remember, even in the valley, god is leading you through.