Walk Through Podcast
The Walk Through Podcast shares authentic stories of navigating life’s valleys & victories, highlighting how we find God in the midst of every season of life. Co-hosted by Gianina and Kiley, each episode offers hope and inspirations through real, raw & faith-filled conversations.
Walk Through Podcast
Beyond the Hustle: Finding True Freedom with Kristen Boss
What happens when you achieve everything you thought you wanted, but still feel empty inside? In this raw and revealing conversation, Kristen Boss takes us behind the curtain of her entrepreneurial journey from hairstylist to multi-million dollar business owner—and the surprising spiritual awakening that changed everything.
Kristen candidly shares how she built a thriving company teaching relationship-based marketing, only to discover she had inadvertently commoditized herself in the process. "I had become the product," she explains, "and anytime you become the thing that you sell to people, there is a part of you that's dehumanizing yourself." Despite financial freedom and external success, Kristen reached a breaking point that led to what she calls "God's great rescue mission on my identity."
The most powerful moments come when Kristen describes her surrender not as beautiful or noble, but as a wrestling match with God—fighting, clawing, and negotiating before finally accepting that her identity had become dangerously enmeshed with her business. With refreshing honesty, she admits, "I had edged out my need for Him. I had become incredibly self-reliant and a slave to my own thing."
Kristen's journey offers profound insights into the false promises of hustle culture and the subtle ways we can replace God with success, achievement, or financial security. Whether you're an entrepreneur feeling trapped by your own creation, someone struggling with identity outside of what you do, or simply wondering if there's more to life than constantly striving, this conversation offers a perspective-shifting reminder that true freedom is found not in what we accomplish, but in whose we are.
This episode will challenge you to examine where you're seeking answers to life's fundamental questions: Am I safe? Do I matter? Do I belong? And it will inspire you to consider what might happen if you placed those questions back where they belong—in the hands of a God who never asks us to hustle for His love.
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Welcome back to the Walkthrough Podcast. We're your hosts, Gianina and Kiley, and friends. We cannot believe we're stepping into season two. We're so excited to be back with you and so thankful you're walking through another season of life and faith with us here on the podcast. We believe that life is a journey meant to be walked step by step with Jesus. Together, we get to talk about what it means to trust Him in the highs and lows and how he shows up in every part of our stories. And what better way to kick off Season 2 than with today's guest? Kristen Boss is a coach, author and podcast host who's passionate about helping people live and lead with purpose, not out of our hustle or striving, but from a place of rest, identity and calling. She reminds us that the work God has for us flows out of who we are in Christ, not how much we can accomplish. We know this conversation is going to encourage you, challenge you and point you back to Jesus. So grab your coffee, settle in and let's walk through this new season together with Kristen Boss.
Kiley:Hello Kristen, Thank you so much for being on with us today. We're so excited to have you. Before we dive into it, I would like I know that you we were supposed to record a couple weeks ago and we got a little sidetracked, and I know that you probably have some followers that are listening to this. So I first want to know how are you feeling, how are you doing, Because I'm sure other people might want to know if you're okay, I am great.
Kristen:Yeah, I had a crazy kind of scary health crisis three weeks ago and it was just very spontaneous and random. Turns out I was. I had a leak in my brain. It was the most crazy, wild thing and I learned how to advocate for myself with good old chat GPT and I'm very thankful I got an early diagnosis, because most people will go years without a diagnosis or being misdiagnosed. So, man, I feel really good, almost back to 100%, but it was wild.
Kiley:I'm really glad to hear that. Yeah, I was reading some of that whole thing and I'm thinking, oh my gosh, I don't know Cause. I've been a I've been a headache and migraine sufferer for a long time, but nothing to that extent, and so, like you, just wouldn't think. Obviously, when you have all that pain, you're just wondering what is going on in my body, and I don't think a leak is anything that anybody ever anticipates.
Kristen:Yeah, no, no one thinks. You know. I wonder if my cerebral spinal fluid is potentially somewhere. It gave me. It gave me a lot of empathy for people that are chronic migraine sufferers. I just I'm not one prone to headaches at all. That's why I knew something was very wrong. But during that I was like, wow, I cannot imagine people that have to live with this on a regular basis. I just couldn't even imagine. So it gave me a lot of empathy for people that feel maybe limited by what their bodies can do or won't do, and I don't know. I just had a lot of empathy. It gave me a lot of time to reflect, for sure.
Kiley:I'm so glad that you're doing better. Yeah, me too. So, to get into your story, yours is one that a lot of women can relate to. So can you just kind of start from the beginning and tell us how you started sharing online the way that you did, and just we'll just take it from there line the way that you did and just, we'll just take it from there.
Kristen:Yeah, so, uh, my husband and I, we, we have been married for 13 years and when we got married I was a hairstylist. I was a, um, a hairstylist in, uh, the Hollywood scene for a while in Los Angeles, and then we moved to Colorado to start over and my husband was in the ministry. He was a youth pastor, so he had been doing that for a number of years. And you know, someone going into ministry they don't do that for money, that is for sure. Youth ministry, even more so, like, those are the pastors that are, you know, they're living off of takeout pizza and the charity of parents, are like, yeah, we'll pay for your ice cream too.
Kristen:Uh, so that was our story for a long time. Um, in fact, for the first, like seven years of our marriage, we, we were very much ships passing in the in the night. We didn't, um, we didn't have the same day off together. We, um, it was it's very much a season of survival. Um, so I love doing hair, I loved the relationship components of that, but, uh, I, I don't know, I felt like I was meant for more and, um, the part I loved most about, you know, people sitting in my chair was conversations, was the people. I loved the creativity and, um, yes, but I I needed something at the time, and so I got into, you know, marketing and selling a product online, and that helped us get through some really hard seasons when my husband went through unemployment.
Kristen:And my husband and I we've really gone through a lot of seasons that might be seen as non-traditional, where he stayed at home with the babies and I was the primary earner or sole earner for a time, and then he even went into a parachurch ministry he was with Fellowship of Christian Athletes, and where we literally had to go out and raise our salary. I have thoughts about that too. Whereas at one point we were like our own biggest, we were our biggest donors, at some point it was just, it was wild. So what I noticed was just, you know, I've been online for a really long time. I started my Instagram account probably in 2015, 2014.
Kristen:So, like, uh, been doing that a while and I just remember sharing like mom content and it just and I but I cared a lot about, I care a lot about mindset. Mindset was really fascinating to me and just the idea that you could um, um, improve your relationship with yourself and others by understanding yourself. And so I kind of got into personal development and I remember one of the first things I did was I was asked to be a speaker for Mops, which I think it's something else now. Isn't it called like MomCo or something like that? They've rebranded Mops.
Speaker 4:I was going to say it was still Mops, but I was a part of it.
Kristen:So yeah, I think they've rebranded it. I think it's like MomCo now, and so that was like my first speaking gig where I was like I was in a church basement with like all these like 30 moms sitting around these round tables, everyone's sleep deprived on their 10th cup of coffee, and I think it was just talking about like, oh, I'm just gonna. What does it look like to have a, you know, a positive mindset and motherhood? And that was all well and good, but eventually I I had a heart for how I saw women who wanted to make money online and how they were being taught to market and sell, and so I was like you know, I'm gonna, I'm gonna help them. Marketing and sales makes a lot of sense to me. I'm going to teach them a different way of doing this that might feel more organic, more relationally based, and so I just started talking about that and, before I knew it, I started this. I had this company that grew very fast and great, very big, and I became a kind of a thought leader and a voice in the network marketing and direct sales space, and that space has a lot of negative connotations and I'm not going to say that they're not warranted. I think they're perfectly warranted.
Kristen:I think we have seen some people not steward their business well, not steward relationships well, and so I was like well, how can I change the narrative there? How can I equip people who, actually, who can't go back to school or can't go, you know, get another job, or someone does need to be home, like who are we to say how someone should be providing financially for their family and their home? So you know, that was kind of how I was showing up, and so one of the things that was fascinating to me, though, is I always loved consumer and buyer psychology, psychology. I'm I'm a nerd, I'm an absolute nerd, and like I, if I'm not reading about like dragons and fairies, I'm reading about psychology. Okay, so I, I love that. I was like how can I teach, you know, sales and marketing through the lens of psychology, empathy and, uh, just being more human, and so it took off. It went really well, um and uh.
Kristen:I saw a lot of success very fast. It went from like just having this thing where I thought I'm going to help people, to suddenly not suddenly, but relatively quickly having a company with people, with employees, with more money than I could possibly ever imagine for myself, and that has its own, has its own things. And so I had to get over a lot of stories about money before I even started my business, like is it right, is it, is it godly, is it okay, is it what, what? How much is an appropriate amount? Like you know, we were in ministry, so I think in some way was, we were kind of indoctrinated by maybe a poverty gospel, that's, that's more. It's more noble to suffer, to be without, don't have excess. And so there was a lot I had to I don't know unlearn, relearn, sit with, explore. And so, yeah, I had this really successful company.
Kristen:I wrote a book, had a podcast, and it was the season of a lot, it was the season of everywhere I went, I was getting validation like woohoo, she's on, there's Kristen Bosch, she's on stages and here's her podcast and keynote speaking, and you know this company. And so it was all well and good until it wasn't. And so probably it was about actually about a year and a half ago from today. Um, I started, not, I was, I was feeling very restless.
Kristen:I had, I had everything I could possibly imagine, all the, all the luxuries that life could possibly afford. Um, and I was deeply, uh, unfulfilled and I couldn't figure out why. And then I had a lot of guilt around that, like you have more than you could possibly imagine and you're unfulfilled. What is wrong with you? And it was, you know there was. I had a longing and the messaging I was sharing with people I was just like is this what I want to be known for? Is this my legacy of you know? Do I want to? You know? At the end of my days, do I want to say you know, kristen, how did you help someone? Well, I helped them optimize their Instagram so that they could make more money online and, you know, it killed my soul and I felt like there was just a lot of inadvertently.
Kristen:I didn't realize I had done this, but I had built a business that was very centered around me and I didn't know it at the time. It was a very personal, brand-based business and I had inadvertently commoditized myself. I had made myself the product, and anytime you become the thing that you sell to people, there is a part of you. You're dehumanizing yourself. You become a product, so you start to think of yourself. As a part of you, you're dehumanizing yourself. You become a product, so you start to think of yourself as a product and like how can I make myself more shiny, more palatable, if people aren't buying? It's a rejection of you, something's wrong with you.
Kristen:I developed, I would say, an unhealthy enmeshment where I didn't know where I began and my business started. I was one in the same and so, yeah, in that, I think there was this my soul was crying out for. Like this is not. There's more to life than this entrepreneurial rat race that is touted in the online space of like this I'm going to call it the false promise of make all this, make all the money and all your problems go away. You know, I I don't know how else to describe it other than it was like I, I bought, I bought the dream, I bought the ticket, and I went down the yellow brick road and I, like you know, met the wizard, and I found that it wasn't a wizard. It was a man behind the curtain that was lying the whole time being like wait, what? What do you mean? Like this doesn't fix everything, and so I had to start asking some really hard questions and eventually it led to me realizing this thing I had built, it was no longer aligned with where I was going, and that meant being willing to disappoint thousands of people that were like, no, but this is, you're our person, you're our cheerleader, you're the voice, you're the boss, babe, you're the thing.
Kristen:And for me to go out and then say, I actually, this doesn't align with me anymore. I had to be willing for thousands of people to feel a sense of betrayal, like how could you, how could you leave, how could you pivot, how could you do this? And so I have talked about that pivot, which is really ironic because the book I wrote five years ago was called Pivot to Purpose. I thought I had already done one pivot, but God was like I've got a much, much bigger, scarier pivot for you. And so I call this most recent pivot.
Kristen:When I decided to close the business that you know had brought in I mean millions, and it didn't just like give financial safety and security, it also fed identity, it gave a lot of emotional fulfillment, like so much tied up in that it wasn't just closing business doors, it was like, to put it very bluntly, I told somebody I said I decided to cut off a relationship with my drug dealer, the thing that I was so wrapped up in. I had such a I'm going to even call it a success addiction. It was just never enough and it was a great cost, and so I call this most recent pivot. I believe it was God's great rescue mission on my identity. Yeah, so I don't know if that's like that's kind of like the long short, not quite, I mean like we could go anywhere from there. I'm in a you know, I've got a startup now, but yeah, that's kind of kind of a little bit of the story, the short of it.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I absolutely love that. That's kind of kind of a little bit of the story, the short of it. Yeah, I absolutely love that. And you know, just to say, like I have been following you for a really long time and actually I discovered last week or the other week we're actually friends on Facebook, so that's how far back it goes. Oh, this is interesting, I didn't even realize that.
Speaker 4:But so I've been following like your training and things like that, and I really feel like God is up to something, because I know we had that conversation where it's like I started feeling that same tub. I've been successful in what I'm doing and I've reached a top level in my company and I've taught other people to do the same thing. And I just came to this point where it's like, exactly like what you said, is this what I want to be known for at the end of my life? Like there has to be more than just helping people make money online, and I know that there is a great purpose in that. I don't want to diminish that what anyone else is doing because, honestly, like for me, it helped me be able to start over with my son without having to put him in daycare and all these things, and so there is a benefit to it and there is like a ministry to that almost.
Speaker 4:But I do feel like God is kind of tugging on people's hearts where it's not so much about the success and the shiny trips and who do you know and where can you go from this? You know there's so much more to life and even to social media, because I feel like up until now we've really just seen a lot of sales, like everywhere you go on social media, someone's selling to you, selling something you know, and so just turning it more into a space. And I really feel like after COVID hit and all that happened, I just craved this community that was different than what I was currently getting online. Like I wanted to connect with people face-to-face and kind of in a different way as well. So I would love to know what was that turning point like for you, when God spoke to you and revealed to you there's something deeper than this, like how did you tell your husband? How did you like navigate?
Kristen:that I would say my husband saw it. He saw the writing on the wall, he saw it coming. I'm not going to pretend that it was some like really beautiful, noble surrender where I'm like, okay, lord, you asked this of me, here you go. No, it was like Jacob wrestling God in the middle of the night, like God's going to have to, like the angel of the Lord is going to have to touch my hip, dislocate me. I'm going to have to walk away with a limp type of fighting, clawing, negotiating, bartering. I mean I went through the five phases of grief. I was like anger, denial, bartering and then, inevitably, acceptance.
Kristen:I would say there was a long time where I was bartering, like can I have a little bit? What about this? Can I keep these offers here but not sell them anymore? Can I have them just over there? And God just had a way I don't know how else to put it, other than someone said to me we know that God never lifts his favor over us. He loves us, we are his children, but he will move an anointing. The anointing might lift over an area where you have been called and it felt like the anointing had been lifted, in the sense that the things that once felt easy light. In many ways, I felt like I had the Midas touch, like I could touch something and it would turn to gold.
Kristen:That started to not happen. It was like tiny little things started to break, things that weren't making sense, things that always I don't know how to put it other than like massive resistance in areas where there was ease and areas there was flow, and being like why is this happening? And I'm a master business person. I can solve problems all day long. It's I'm going to keep solving it, but I think eventually there was the business and then a personal crisis.
Kristen:It took a real meltdown on my part, realizing I'm not okay and that I was kind of had I don't know how to put it like had compartmentalized myself so much that I didn't know who I was. And it's not every day, like when some people are like where was your rock bottom? I was like, well, it's kind of ironic that my rock bottom happened at 30,000 feet in the air in a private plane and I was evaluating my life and if I wanted to I know this is dark and maybe a trigger warning, but I was evaluating if I want to go home at all, and so that was kind of when I realized I'm not okay, we have got to look at why, and I have to be willing to put everything on the table. So it was slow.
Kristen:It was like six months of grieving, processing, of working through fears of like what, if, what, will people say? What people think? This is what I'm known for, and one of my biggest fears which was interesting one of my biggest fears is becoming irrelevant, that I don't matter anymore. And so for years I think I was just I can't begin to tell you how often I was trying to keep up the pace, just so I would never become irrelevant. So I had to be like what's the newest, hottest Instagram strategy, what's the hook, what's the thing, what's the topic? And not from a place of like, how can I serve my audience? It's like how can I make sure that I don't disappear? And so that because if I don't have answers, then I don't matter, and if I don't matter, then why am I here? And so, like I had to, I think the biggest fear I had to make peace with is that my deep fear that people would no longer see me as worthy if I wasn't doing that, wasn't known for that like that I might become irrelevant to some people and making peace with that.
Kristen:So there was nothing beautiful about my surrender or my pivot. To be honest with you, it was messy, it was hard, a crap. Ton of therapy, going away to an intensive deep therapy retreat for a week and not having my phone. It was. It was ugly. What do you want me to tell you? It was like I tell people I'm like. It was like rehab. I was like I've been detoxing from my past success for the last like nine months and it has been brutal, brutal. There's nothing cute about it.
Kiley:Yeah, no, I feel like. I feel like that speaks volumes to the relationship that God has created us to be in, Because with anything, when people start to identify themselves in what they do, like you were saying, I'm worried about becoming irrelevant. How do I stay on top of it? And especially now there are so many people that get their income by being influencers or social marketing and stuff, and it's I almost feel like that's when, when it gets intense like that, that's like the enemy's attack, like you don't. You don't need this relationship to sustain you. All you have to do is just stay relevant, keep up with it, keep going, you'll be fine. But deep down inside you realize it's not there. You know you were doing incredible things, amazing things, but you still felt that pull like okay, there's, there's something missing, there's something different. And so did you feel in. In those moments did you feel like you were maybe almost being pulled further away from your relationship with God, and that's what that tug was, or like what did that look?
Kristen:like for you. And it took my breaking point for me to feel a need for him again. Because I will tell you, I think the thing that was scariest. Now listen, I'm not here to say, like money is just a resource, it's just paper, that's all it is. Like you cannot, there's no morality to money.
Kristen:But I will say, having that much money, I don't think I realized how much I could just buy myself out of any uncomfortable feeling I ever had. Like I could, I could buy myself out of anything I could. I could go to any five star hotel, buy a bag, buy a thing you know, download it. Like I. I denied myself nothing. And so when you are able to just buy yourself out of discomfort, where is a need for God? I had bought myself like I had. I didn't know it, but I had edged out my need for him. And so I had become incredibly self-reliant and I had become a slave to my own, to my own thing, to this. Yeah, I had built a cage. I had become enslaved by the very thing I built, which is so funny because entrepreneurs were lured in by the word freedom, and often we become a slave to how we obtain that elusive freedom. And I will tell you there is no freedom outside of Jesus.
Kristen:There is no freedom there is like this freedom that is painted for you. I will tell you, I had a friend of mine. We were going through a real hard time. Her life was really hard. I have some good friends that are eight, nine figure business owners worth up. Their net worth is over a hundred million. And I'm calling them and their lives, their lives, their problems. They're no different than yours and mine, they're the same. We're like, we're just, they're just crying into a crystal decanter instead of, you know, a mason jar. It's like. It's like. Me and my friend were like, yeah, life sucks and we're crying, but we're crying in first class. I mean, I don't know what to tell. It's there. And so, yeah, I would say, letting the thing go, letting the business go, was the ultimate.
Kristen:Who is your source? Who is your supply? Where do you get that? And it has been a? Um has been hard. It has been a very slow uh, I don't know how to call it like a slow romance between me and God. Of like him gently bringing me back and, uh, I don't know, recalibrating my soul. Of just like, hey, this is what I have for you, this is true peace, this is true freedom. And there's no amount of commas in a paycheck that you can't buy, that you can't buy freedom. Trust me.
Kiley:I've tried. I wonder if your experience was a way of him showing you that you do have the ability to do that. But now he wants to break it all down and start fresh and say, okay, let's, let's try this again. Oh yeah, let's, let's do it with me at the center.
Kiley:And I remember my dad telling me a long time ago cause you know money, like you said earlier, you know, you grow up in the church and you, you, you know frugality and you know we're a ministry. We're not. You know this, you know. So we're kind of trained to believe that just because we're believers means that we have to. I mean, I think it's good to live in modesty anyway, but we're kind of trained to believe that a ton of money is like a bad thing. And my dad said it's not. It's not that money is the root of all evil, it's the pursuit of money and that's where it gets dangerous. And so I think if you're a good steward of that, you know God's going to use that. But it's so, it's so easy, I would imagine, to get caught up in. Like you said, like I, I didn't have a niche for God because I didn't really, I didn't need him for anything, because I could do anything that I wanted. So yeah, yeah yeah, it's, it's.
Kristen:I think you know one thing I heard that was really fascinating. I don't know if you know this, but Ed Milet. He's a, he's a Christian and he I was in a group with him and he said he's like, in many ways he's like my wealth has given me access to people who, like, when they see me pull up in the Ferrari and this might be, you know, maybe not all of us can relate to this example, but it's something to at least sit with he's like when I pull up in my Ferrari. I have earned conversations with people and been able to speak Jesus because I drove up in a Ferrari and I was like, oh dang. You kind of think of like, oh, wow.
Kristen:But in some ways, if you think of, like Paul, how he said I become all things to all men so that the gospel might be made known to all, it's just like, oh well, how do we do that? How do we? How do we do that? How do we again live in this world and do those things but not become so consumed by it and not lose ourselves in it and I will say there was a season where I lost myself in that for sure. So, like I said this has been the big, like the great identity rescue of, uh, of, yeah, of Kristen Boss.
Kiley:I guess I don't know how many people are going to roll up to somebody in a Toyota and be like, yeah, that car.
Speaker 4:I do want to say, you know, obviously we're talking about the financial aspect, but this can be connected to so many different things, really, anything that you find your identity in other than Christ. It can be in a ministry that you have where you have basically focused so much on that that you've stepped ahead of God and you're not even keeping Him at the center. It could be a relationship that you have. It could be I mean, really it could be. We just spoke with somebody last week where it was a sport, you know something that they really thrived in and they were really good at, and so it could be athleticism. It could be your body, it could you know anything that you're making a God, a head of God, and we say we don't do that because we're like no, like God's number one.
Speaker 4:But then where's our actual focus going? And where do we go to? Yeah, like, where do we go to when, like you said, we're hurting? Are we going to God or are we going to something else that we think is going to fulfill us? And so this really can relate to so many different things. That isn't just like monetary, but we find our identity in like for a long time and I've talked about this a little bit like I led worship and when I stepped down from that, it's like I didn't know what my identity was in the church. You know, where do I belong, kind of like you said, like is my voice still going to be relevant? Am I still going to be used by God? And so we can make really anything that idol, anything that we find our identity in.
Kristen:There's this we all walk through life asking three questions and we ask am I safe, am I loved and do I matter? And if you are going to your job, anything where you are, wherever you are asking that question or getting that answer, if it is not being answered by God himself, you have to evaluate why am I seeking? Do I matter here? Why am I seeking? Am I loved here? Why am I like? Or, if it's not, am I loved it's, do I belong? It's like am I safe, do I matter and do I belong? And so, for me, my business answered. I ran there all the time Like am I safe? Yes, the business is good, it's great, I can believe I'm secure. Do I matter? Well, everybody's making these comments and telling me it's great. Oh, therefore, I'm going to keep showing up. Do I belong? Well, look, they love me and I love them. So it's just like, wherever you are asking that question, you have to evaluate why you're running there and not to God himself.
Kiley:Yeah, that's really good. How do you walk in obedience when the world says to hustle but God says to rest?
Kristen:Oh Jesus, lord, Jesus, come with me now. Lord, this is going to be my work for the rest of my life. We all have a unique wiring for how we respond to fear or how we respond to uncertainty and to risk. How I have been wired is when I feel scared, I work. When I feel scared, I I will throw myself into productivity, I will throw myself into what I can do to make money.
Kristen:And so, when I understand that, when I understand why I run, where the hustle is from understanding, it's the scared part of me, it's the part of me that feels unsafe. It's the part of me that's asking do I matter? Do I belong? Am I okay? Learning to love that part of me? And I don't think that hustle part of me. She's never going to go away. She's, she's deeply ingrained in me, she's a part of me. Um, but it's learning to be with that part and being like, okay, what, what do I need to know in this moment? What, why, why do I want to run? What do I need to? Uh, where do I need to go back to truth? How do I need to go back to Jesus? What does it look like? And the world is always going to sell you. We are the American culture especially. I mean we are hustle culture. It's just like the American dream is the promoters of it, and so it's in many ways.
Kristen:I think some people think, in order to not be indoctrinated by hustle culture, they think they have to be like well, that means I'm lazy, checked out. I'm almost saying like the pendulum swing too far. The other way, it's like the soft girl era. It's like I'm like hey, I can be there and make a joke, and I think I saw something hilarious, like I don't want girl boss, I want to melt into the forest floor and have moss grow over me. I want to be girl moss. That's the funniest thing. And like I think we can laugh about that.
Kristen:But I was just like I think there is a healthy level of what does it look like to to intentionally engage with your purpose in the world from a place of like, what is it? What is a grounded pursuit look like, versus a pursuit where I have lost myself, where I'm scared. What's what's driving your pursuit? Pursuit that's always going to be cause. Uh, what it can look like externally might be somewhat. You can look at the activities and you might see two people doing the same things, but what's driving me, the behavior? Is I really what's behind the hustle, so to speak? And so, for me, I always have to look at what's what's driving this. Am I scared? Okay, we got to take it. We got to check in with ourselves here, you know, or is this like? Hey, I'm, I'm engaging in a way that where I'm stewarding the gifts that God has given me, and that's why I love the story of the, of the talent so much is like.
Kristen:You know, there was the, the master that gave his servants all a certain allotted amount of talents, and there was one that was afraid and buried it. And they came back and he's like what have you done? He's like well, I thought you'd be mad. So, instead of risking it, I buried it. And I think that's what a lot of people do with their talents Instead of embarrassing myself or maybe risking it or failure, I just kept it safe, I played small, whereas the ones that went out, they're like I went and multiplied my talents. That is intentional and purposeful engagement with utilizing and stewarding the gifts that we are given. So it's just like we always have to check in with ourselves, and so this is going to be my work for the rest of my life and it's and I know, have I hustled since A hundred percent. But am I catching myself sooner, faster, with a lot more compassion? Yes, absolutely so.
Kiley:Yeah, that's so good. When you were talking, it reminded me of something that our pastor said this last weekend in church and he said your heavenly father is not afraid of the thing that you are, and it was like that's good that's because he knows your story, he knows the ending.
Kiley:Oh and, and I think that's why he tell us, don't be anxious, don't be worried, because you know he he talked about when they're in the boat during the storm and he's taking a nap, it's not because he didn't care, it's because he knew where they were headed. He knew that they were going and he knew that his like he was headed for the cross, so obviously nothing was going to happen to him during that storm, so he wasn't afraid of it. And it's like, ok, if we catch ourselves, like you said, hustling because we're afraid or because you know, we just want to make sure we do it right, like we have to again ground ourselves in Jesus too. And no, he already knows the ending of our story. So we just have to, you know, just go along with it and not be afraid of what's going to come between us.
Kristen:If you look at, like the life of Jesus, that man was never in a hurry, yeah, never in a hurry. Like. If you think about that, like and there were so many times where people were like Jesus, hurry, we need you. Or it's like Jesus, my son at home he's dying, my daughter is dying, and he'd be like I'll get to it, Like it. Just he was never alarmed, like the son of God was never alarmed. Like the son of a god was never alarmed, yeah, so it's just like we can trust in his good timing and that he operates outside of our very small human perspective.
Speaker 4:Yeah, yeah yeah, and we have this now or never, mentality like if we have this opportunity now, we got to take it and run with it or else it's never going to happen again. You know, think the story of the three talents. When you said I realized something that I had never actually made this realization before. But we have these talents and I think the beautiful part of that story is the people who are working and like multiply the talents. They knew that talent was going back to their master. They didn't work to be able to keep some of that or to be able to like okay, he gave me, you know, these 10 pieces of silver. What am I going to do with it so that I can have more? At the end they saw it as okay, I have this to multiply, to give back to my master, you know. So just like thinking of our talents in the same way of I'm multiplying this and stewarding this well so that I can give it back to God, because it's not mine to keep anyways.
Kristen:Yeah, it's a stewardship story.
Kiley:Yeah, and along the same line, I remember seeing something I'm probably going to mess it up, but it said something like I remember praying for the things that I have now it up. But it said something like I remember praying for the things that I have now, but now I need to pray that I will be a good steward of these things and help it grow and help it mean something more than just okay. I have everything that I want now, so I'm just going to hang out.
Kristen:Yeah, it's funny you say that because that's kind of like what my kind of the rebuild in the new season I'm in. I could have very well taken the things and we could have probably bought a property somewhere, lived debt free and lived off of the interest for the rest of our lives. I could have done that and, trust me, it was very appealing. I was like, yes, property chickens, I might try this trad wife thing. God appealing, I was like, yes, property chickens, I might try this trad wife thing. God laughed. He's like that's hilarious. I didn't make you that way. That's why I realized, like he made me with, with all of these gifts and these talents, what a shame to hide them because my ego felt fragile, what a shame.
Kiley:Or just because you wanted to stay comfortable. Nobody wants to go outside of their comfort zone ever. Yeah, 100%.
Speaker 4:Yeah. So on that note, I would love to know where are you now? What's next for you?
Kristen:That's a great question. Every day is different. No, we have a startup company that we're still refining and doing those things now. But the thing I cared about was because in my programs I did a lot of strategic coaching, like, hey, just do this, here's what you do.
Kristen:But what I really started to have a heart for was getting to the root cause of inaction. Like what? What drives someone's like how is it that I can take the same strategy, the same playbook and give it to five different people and two will run, two will shut down? And I think of it kind of like the parable of like the seeds in different soils, like why is it? Why? Why will some spring up and die immediately? Why are some like have some success and then the you know they're scattered to the wind. Why?
Kristen:And understanding that the human behavior behind that, and realizing I want to help people get to the root of this and if I can enrich this part of their life, then we can enrich every part of their life. So you know, we're building, we have a new company now, it's known as Sondera and we it's all about, you know, helping people through the lens of nervous system intelligence, understanding their stress response, understanding their wiring and it's like, hey, the reason why you procrastinate is actually, it's not because you're lazy. There's actually a scientific reason behind that that you're wired this certain way. When you understand how you're wired, then we can take an approach that matches you. So that's kind of what I'm doing. That's what I'm doing right now. It doesn't sound sexy or glamorous and I will tell you right now it is not sexy or glamorous. It is like I'm living all the things, all the lessons I told my students for years and I'm like this is fun.
Kiley:But you know, I think it's going to go a long way because there's a lot of people that want to better understand themselves Me for one they do, and it's usually, you know, I was telling my therapist this.
Kristen:I said how can I help people heal these things before they're having a crisis like I did?
Kristen:How do I help people get ahead of it? And the thing is with high performers is we usually don't see value in these things until we crash and burn, and so it's just having to have that, the love and the patience of like, waiting, being like. I know I'm not the sexy strategy you want right now. I know I'm not the diet pill, but we'll be here when you're ready to do the real work that's going to give you sustainable results and feel in every area of your life. And so, yeah, I tell people I'm like it's a less sexy offer and I coach and consult other business owners who are scaling and growing large, large companies, and what I love coaching on is their decision-making, their leadership abilities, how they're able to manage and regulate stress, their emotional health.
Kristen:I mean your emotional health is the compass and the kind of the thermostat for every area of your life, and so it's kind of funny. No business owner is excited about that. They're like nah, can't you just show me a funnel? I'm like, um, yes, I can do that, but every business problem is actually a business owner problem, and unless we get you to perform better, your business isn't going to perform better. So that's the land Kristen Boss is in right now.
Speaker 4:Yeah, I love it. It's as you were saying that I thought of, like man. Isn't that how God works, too, though? Because it's like there's all these things that can bring temporary satisfaction or temporary healing, or temporary fulfillment that we run to because we want something easy and we want something fast, and God's like okay, I know this isn't the glamorous thing, but if you just get in your word, if you just pray, if you just spend time with me, if you just let me work in your life, all these other things are going to start to, you know, work out, and so, instead, we run to drugs, or we run to alcohol, or we get a bottle of wine every single night, or even friendships.
Speaker 4:You know, that's something that I really struggle with. A lot is, I'll have a problem and I'll run to Kylie, or I'll run to one of my friends. I'm like what do you think about this? And God's just been really teaching me, okay, do you care my opinion about this? And so I loved when you said that, because I'm like man. That's like exactly how God works. You know, he wants to slow us down and we don't take any shortcuts, we don't take the easy way out, because none of those things really are sustaining, like it might work for a little while, but it's not going to work for the long run.
Kristen:I tell people we all have to have our Solomon moment, like meaningless, meaningless, it's all meaningless. I've done all these things and had all these things and, you know, someone was like how are you doing? I was like I'm in the Ecclesiastes chapter of my life. Where it's all meaningless is when we finally recognize our vices do not serve us in the long term, that those short, short term really are short term and they it comes at a detriment to ourselves. It only distances, you know, um us from from God himself, and so, um, yeah, it really is the work. It's not sexy work, it is hard work.
Kiley:I've even in positions where, um, you know, even just scrolling social media cause you that that little dopamine hit, and then you end up scrolling for an hour and then you're just like, well, I still don't really feel any different, like I feel worse, exactly Like. What am I doing with my life? There to be something more than just go back to my phone and watching reels all day?
Speaker 4:Yeah, for sure. Well, the last question that I have is what would you say to someone that is in the same position that you were in, kind of before you had this revelation, and they just feel stuck and they're in that cycle of fear or comparison, or failure yeah great question I would say this feeling you feel is not an accident, and you can try to wish it away, ignore it.
Kristen:Brene Brown said this quote so beautifully once. She said unexpressed creativity, it does not die, it metastasizes, it becomes a cancer, it consumes us. We become sick with it. And so I think of this idea of like this dream in your heart. That is a form of unexpressed creativity. And I think when we deny it because of a small thing I know it doesn't feel small in the moment as our, as our fear, you know it festers.
Kristen:And I really do think this. You can try, and you know, ignore it or distract yourselves, but it's not going to go away. It tends to compound, it gets bigger until it becomes undeniable. And you know God is not surprised by that desire in your heart. And so have you ever thought it's there because of how you're wired and who you are, and God's not, god's not going to give, put a desire or a dream in your heart without also giving you the tools and you know, and the resources to attain that. And so it is like a. You know how big is your trust, and so I love the idea. Like I heard this expression, fear is putting your faith in Satan. I was like oh, oh, yeah, yeah. I was like oh, geez, that's putting your putting your faith in Satan. That's, that's to monetize on your fear.
Gianina:Yeah.
Speaker 4:He's the only one that stands to benefit? Yeah, yeah, for sure. I was wondering how do you know when I was thinking at first, how do you know if a dream that's in your heart is your dream or if it's God's dream? But do you feel like? If it's in your heart, God put it there for a reason that's a great question.
Kristen:I think something from the Lord feels like a running to you're being called to. I think something that is of the flesh or yourself feels like a running from, like I need to get away from this. I don't want this. This is hard, this is I don't want to be. This is hard, this is I don't want to be here.
Kristen:But if there's a calling to, a calling up, I think that is how God works. That is so. I think, if you were being called up to something yes, lord, that it does it stretch you, does it move you beyond what you feel is capable, does it actually force you to be more reliant on God, that that is something to explore. But I would say, if the root we have to explore the root If the root is, this is for me and what I want, or I'm afraid, or I, this, I, I, I me, me.
Kristen:We got to check in, we got to check in and I think we continually, I will tell you, with this new business venture, my husband and I, we spent, oh gosh, I think, every step of the way. We just kept praying, we're just like all right, it feels like we're hearing this. Can you bring us confirmation, and he can give confirmation in many different ways through your peers, through scripture. There's a lot of ways, just like God is not limited in his creativity in speaking to you. And so I think when we say, like Lord, speak, he will speak. You just have to be obedient to look. So for us, we just every every step. We're like all right, we think we're hearing this and unless we see a door closed, we're going to keep going. And so, yeah, I would say like there is a dream, but you can sit on it all day. The only way to know is to start taking action and like, each step, the Lord is going to speak and he will not steer you wrong.
Speaker 4:Yeah, that's really good. Cool, Kylie, did you have any other questions?
Kiley:Yeah, I mean, I could probably ask so many questions. I want to be your friend so that we can keep communicating with each other.
Speaker 4:Well, I would love it if you would want to pray for our guests and pray for any of our listeners, I think, just anyone who has kind of been in that boat, where you've been, whether on a small scale or large scale, of just that insecurity, and especially someone who had that moment kind of where you were on the airplane of like, do I do, I want to move forward, do I want to do, I want to go home right now, or someone who's feeling like so hopeless, like that's, that's their thought process.
Kristen:Yeah, yeah, I can. I'd be happy to pray. Yeah, father, god, thank you so much for these women who are fostering this conversation on the show and thank you for the ways that they are serving their listeners and the ways they are showing up in their daily life. I just want to pray specifically for the listener who's listening right now, who has felt kind of that nudge of maybe it's affirmation, maybe it's conviction, maybe it's direction, a glimmer of hope. Lord, do not let that feeling fade, god. We ask right now that you give that person a measure of courage, even if it's just a teaspoon, to help them take just the next right step, and that it does not have to be by their strength, but that they can rely on you and your strength and that we can. We can have faith that you go before us, that you, you know our steps. You have already seen, seen our life as it's laid out, and you have asked us just to trust, and we are so thankful that you are so compassionate and patient with us in our fickleness, in our moments where we are like are you sure, god, I don't know, did I hear you correctly? Thank you so much for just all the examples in scripture, where your servants did question and they said God, are you sure? Did I hear you correctly? Can I just push back on this? God, can I get one more sign? I am so thankful for your never-ending compassion for our human condition and that you love us so much to let us come with you with our doubts. I think what an opportunity, when we have fear, that it draws us to engage with you, because if every moment is a moment filled with courage, then why are we crying out for you? And so, in those moments where we question ourselves, where maybe the listener is thinking you know, am I small, am I enough, do I matter? Asking those big life questions, am I loved, do I belong? Do I matter, god, the answer is yes, yes, yes, but only when you answer that for us as our Father who loves us so much.
Kristen:So, lord, I pray for the person that feels maybe hopeless right now or despair right now. First, give them courage to, as soon as they are done with this podcast, that they reach out to one person and say I am not OK and I need help, that there is no weakness in that, that it takes great courage and great bravery to do that. I pray that that person just calls the one person and that the person they call that person will pick up. I pray for the person that feels a measure of creativity in their soul that they will not let it fester, that it will not be unexpressed, that it will be the coin and the talent that they will go out and faithfully multiply that they were steward well, so that at the end of their days they can say, god, I multiplied what you gave me and that you can say well done, my good and faithful servant.
Kristen:Because that is the praise we long for, lord, when I think of the expression we live for the applause of nail-scarred hands. Maybe we never forget that, that only your applause matters and that we live to please you and that, thank God, our merit is never based on our output. Thank God that you do not ask us to hustle for your love, that it is free and it is there and we can have it in full measure. Thank you for inviting us into your rest. Thank you for being that good shepherd who leads us beside still waters. We are so thankful for that. So I pray for those that are tired, that have been hustling a long time, that they can rest, that they can rest at your feet and that they can be restored and refreshed and renewed. We thank you for your goodness and your never-ending mercy and compassion. We pray these things in your name, amen.
Gianina:Amen, amen. Wow, what an amazing way to kick off season two. We're so thankful for Kristen Boss and the wisdom she shared today. Amen, amen, step. Thank you so much for joining us for another episode of Walkthrough Podcast. We love this community and we're so grateful to have you back for a brand new season. Don't forget to share this episode with a friend who needs encouragement today and make sure you subscribe so you never miss a conversation. Until next time, keep walking with Jesus, because he's walking with you.